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On the eve of President\u00a0Joe Biden<\/strong>\u2019s second\u00a0State of the Union<\/a> address,\u00a0Inside the Hive<\/em>\u2019s\u00a0Joe Hagan<\/strong> talks to\u00a0Chris Whipple,<\/strong> author of\u00a0The Fight of His Life: Inside Joe Biden\u2019s White House<\/em><\/a>,<\/em>\u00a0which\u00a0takes us inside the last two years of his presidency\u2014from January 6 to the pandemic, Afghanistan to Ukraine\u2014and offers insight into his future.\u00a0<\/p>\n Biden, Whipple says, is running for president again, age and\u00a0document investigations<\/a> be damned. For Biden\u2019s new chief of staff,\u00a0Jeff Zients<\/strong><\/a>,<\/strong> however, Whipple has some stern advice on managing Biden\u2019s age: \u201cHe\u2019s an octogenarian, he\u2019s running for reelection. Zients has got to make sure that he\u2019s rested enough to do it.\u201d<\/p>\n Biden was surprised, Whipple says, at the staying power of MAGA after the 2020 election and he is taking no chances, gearing up for the inevitable wave of Trumpism in 2024. \u201cThey believe that democracy is very much on the ballot in 2024,\u201d Whipple says.\u00a0<\/p>\n The following transcript excerpt has been edited for clarity and length.<\/em><\/p>\n Vanity Fair:<\/strong><\/em> Biden has succeeded on so many levels, and yet his image remains somewhat muted, you know?<\/strong>\u00a0<\/p>\n Chris Whipple:<\/em>\u00a0Joe Biden is not gonna electrify the populace. He\u2019s not Ronald Reagan, he\u2019s not JFK. But this guy has been underestimated time and time and time again in his political career, most recently during the midterms, as we all know.<\/p>\n To bring the progressive wing of his party to the table, to keep them coherent, especially as we came into the midterms. How did that happen? He had\u00a0Joe Manchin<\/strong> and\u00a0Kyrsten Sinema<\/strong> on the one hand, but he was also stuck with the other side, a very loud and very demanding progressive wing.<\/p>\n I think the answer is a twist on the old expression. \u201cRepublicans don\u2019t belong to any organized political party.\u201d Those are the Democrats. They\u2019re now an organized, disciplined party. And you have to give a lot of credit to Biden, but also to\u00a0Ron Klain,<\/strong>\u00a0who has all of the attributes of some of the great chiefs of staff, the\u00a0Jim Bakers<\/strong> and the\u00a0Leon Panettas.<\/strong><\/p>\n Biden has a new chief of staff, Jeff Zients, without that deep personal relationship that Klain had. I wonder what you think that might mean for the White House?<\/strong><\/p>\n He has a world-class temperament just like Klain, which is one of the attributes of the great chiefs like Baker and Panetta. He\u2019s got all of that. What he lacks is political savvy and knowledge of Capitol Hill and those relationships, and this long relationship with the boss. He has a good relationship with Biden, but, you know, we\u2019ll see whether he has the kind of relationship where he can sit down and second-guess Joe Biden\u2019s political instincts. That\u2019s a tough one, I think. There\u2019s been much speculation that Biden will therefore now rely more heavily on\u00a0Steve Ricchetti<\/strong> and\u00a0Jen O\u2019Malley Dillon<\/strong> and\u00a0Mike Donlan<\/strong> and\u00a0Anita Dunn<\/strong> for political advice. But I think it would be a real mistake to go that route because I think that yes, of course you can get their advice, but presidents learn, often the hard way, that you cannot govern effectively without empowering your chief of staff as first among equals.<\/p>\n Regarding Jill Biden, what do you think the conversation is between her and the president right now?<\/strong><\/p>\n Well, she\u2019s the only person who could talk him out of it. He\u2019s running, there\u2019s just almost no doubt in my mind. And I haven\u2019t heard anybody suggest that Jill Biden is against it. If she is, then he may not go there, but I don\u2019t think there\u2019s any evidence that she is, and I think they\u2019re talking about it. I suspect she\u2019s saying that \u201cif you feel you want to do it, you should go for it,\u201d is my guess.<\/p>\n<\/div>\n